Seeds of Discontent, episode 3 (subculture of poverty, African American families)

Seeds of Discontent, episode 3 (subculture of poverty, African American families)

Seeds of Discontent was a 1968 radio documentary series that explored discontented social groups and organizations attempting to improve their conditions in American society. Created by Hartford Smith, Jr. and Wayne State University’s WDET in Detroit, the series addressed topics including race relations, civil rights, poverty, youth, and crime.

This episode, the first of three exploring the subculture of poverty in the United States, focuses on African American families.

Hartford Smith, Jr.

Originally distributed by WDET in Detroit, Michigan; made available in digitally archived format as part of the Unlocking the Airwaves project, a digital humanities initiative from University of Maryland and the University of Wisconsin-Madison launched in 2021.

1968

Sound

Speaker 0 00:00:03 This is the third in a series of programs entitled the Seeds of Discontent. Here to present the program is Hartford Smith, Jr., Supervisor of the screening and intake unit maintained by the Michigan department of social services, delinquency rehabilitation programs, Mr. Smith. Speaker 1 00:00:22 Thank you. Welcome again to seeds of discontent. Tonight, we begin the first of two programs dealing with a large subcultural poverty. It is essential that this large area of human problems be brought into focus. If the vicious and dehumanizing forces of despair and hopelessness are to be eradicated or according to recent statistics, there are between 25 to 28 million people in this country who are living at or below a basic level of subsistence. In years past this country has looked at the poor as being evil persons who were by some act of God, punished for their sins and immorality. At other times, our country has looked at the poor as lazy persons who simply did not want to work. We have finally come to the realization slowly and by no means with a great degree of consensus, that the problems of the poor are problems, which must be looked at and terms that go beyond the moralistic analysis of an individual. Speaker 1 00:01:28 Let's take a hypothetical example. It is one thing when out of the city's population of 3 million, we have a few hundred unemployed and poor. We might then look more at the personal habits of those few hundred individuals. However, it is quite another story. When out of that population of 3 million, 300,000 are unemployed and poor. We then must look around at societies, basic systems for meeting basic human needs, basic human needs. That must be met. If individuals are to grow and help themselves, our focus tonight will be on how basic needs of poor people are being met. We asked them to tell us about their experiences and the basics of shelter, food, medicine, recreation, and money for clothing. Our interviews were conducted with, uh, residents of the central area of Detroit before presenting their voices and concerns. I'd like you to listen to an artist who reflects their plate. Speaker 2 00:02:39 All cities have this particular residential area in Detroit. They call it black bottom and Cleveland. They call it Euclid avenue, 55th central avenue in Philadelphia. They call it south street and New York city. They call it Harlem dropped down below the cotton curtain called in Atlanta. They call it buttermilk bottom, but then you come out west where it's the best in San Francisco. They call it the pillbox district in Los Angeles. They used to call it clots. They changed the name though. I speak about this place because I'm quite familiar with it. Everyone is in some sense of other. So it all boils down to the same thing though. Speaker 2 00:03:43 Don't speak about this place because you see, I like the winter time when it's very, very cold and it gets cold in Chicago than anywhere else on earth. Because when it's around 10 above zero, and it's about 12 inches of snow outside and the Hawk, speaking of the almighty Hawk, Mr. Wynn, when he blows out the street around 35, 40 miles an hour is just like a giant razor blade blowing down the street and all the clothes in the world can't help you when you live in a place like I lived in where everybody had a key to the front hall door, cause it was it wasn't flat, but then they cut it up into kitchen at apartments. And you leave that from all the opening, the hall get in there. Boy, you be called a bunch of dirt days where you can get in your room. I speak about this, as I said before, because I know because my mama and my God this shack, this Speaker 1 00:05:46 Originally tobacco road was mainly applicable to the south. But in the last 50 years, tobacco road came north with the mill engine of people searching for a better life. Listen to the residents in these areas of Detroit, as they tell you about the basic necessity of housing, Speaker 3 00:06:09 What kinds of problems have you faced in this community in terms of housing? Uh, do you have any difficulty with the landlord keeping the property? Speaker 4 00:06:20 Yeah. We have a whole lot of, a lot of problems about that. You didn't look at the ship building and see that we have a lot of problems. She knew about keeping this, you know, he was in a private Dale because he ain't gonna let you keep it up and he ain't gonna keep it up himself because you don't want to spend no money. They ain't going to spend no money. And the fact that he figured that he ain't get my mother at all of the places you didn't follow, you got full of mice. He got the kids, mice and things. You know, we have set up being called his house eight and nine mice. At one time, they run all around a dog on TV. We used was running around there and all the cat, when we bought red strap on Y traps, where we moved out from up, down around him, we moved out from up there with a house full of roaches and them big rats. And so them rats, they can, uh, they got in the bed with my baby. And that's when we the, to find the Shipley ship, we thought, I don't know, Sunday said to him, we were hunting for police direct down a bit. I don't know which one was the baby nine. I think it was, she was the baby and, and the rat was sitting up on a bill with my baby and I'm scared of rats. Okay. Speaker 3 00:07:44 Well, what kind of problems have you encountered since you, since you've lived in new truck, what kind of problems have you, who you found most difficult for you and your family? Housing housing? Could you tell me a little bit more about that? Speaker 5 00:07:58 First of all, when it ran the place I laid, especially she wanted to be the way she would like it. Nice floors, nice windows and nice walls. Flows, plays a big part in the house, but the average house you move in now, nowadays the floors look like a bottom floor. The walls look like a bomb wall, but they could throw some pants on there and charge you the world and all, and don't feel miss name. And my strength. God is too with the child, need a pair of shoes to wear the rent must be paid, which we know that. But then I did this. I don't mind paying that money. As long as I'm paying for something, when I'm paying a white man for something, I want the same kind of service he wants. When I give him my money, he can bet whatever he wants with it. When I move in his house, I can't do nothing with it because it costs too much to fix it up Speaker 3 00:08:54 About repairs. Uh, what's been your experience. I don't landlords to be cooperative with you, making repairs such as bombing and basic items like that for him. Speaker 5 00:09:07 No, they do not like to cooperate with a woman. You can ask him for one thing and he turned you aside and say another, he'll give you a promise. You won't do it. And I don't feel like that's right, because when I move in there places, when I promised to pay him a certain amount of rent, I looked for the service to be done as promised if I wanted to, uh, my wall was painted. If I asked him to fix my floors, if a window is broken. And if Al has ran in my kitchen, as he is now leaking from the bathroom down. When my , my landlord asked me what was wrong with that. So I told him, I said, would you want your wife house to be, uh, would you want it to be leaking over your sink and your wife? See it? And you tell her with nothing wrong with it. I'm a woman. Like she, I want something decent. And if I am going to pay you rent, you want to fix it. I ain't gonna pay you that. Speaker 3 00:10:03 Roughly. How much would you say your landlord charges for, for an apartment of this size? Speaker 5 00:10:11 Me and myself, I pay $60 a month. Speaker 3 00:10:15 That includes utilities. No, of Speaker 5 00:10:17 Course we know you. Speaker 3 00:10:19 Okay. Well, how much would you estimate that a utility is run per month when it's cold? Speaker 5 00:10:28 The gas bill and the house like this. So is to run this about 50 or $60 a month, Speaker 3 00:10:33 50, $60, because I have a Speaker 5 00:10:36 Lot of air hopes. Speaker 3 00:10:38 How many children in your family, how many people are in your total family for you and what do you do for a living? And he say, based on what I know about various aid programs, that doesn't leave me with very much money than it does When this was supposed to have been an urban renewal area. It appears that, uh, really they tore down more housing and more people came in. Speaker 4 00:11:10 It did because I know somehow just somehow find me has got minute is, uh, 15 and 16 peoples in it. And they ain't got for five rooms. Speaker 3 00:11:22 She got holiday live in. Speaker 4 00:11:23 I believe, I don't know, but it's something right, right there on the corner. It's 15 peoples in 1, 1, 1 apartment, right over there, two apartments without over that 15 in each one. And they ain't got for five rooms, whether it's mama later on that got 11 children. And she staying in that. And then three other grown people just standing in the same house. But check, I bought five rooms. Speaker 3 00:11:55 You indicated you most, all six times or so in the last seven years, thereabouts Speaker 6 00:12:02 Five, Speaker 3 00:12:04 Five times and each time where your kids able to stay in the same school or Speaker 6 00:12:09 No, every time I had to move the kids to, they take care of the task to every place we moved to so far. And they even took the land laws and things. Uh, they don't want us to move, but they not going to fix up the place, but I have to change them out of school. Every time I ever moved, I had to change the kids out of school. Speaker 3 00:12:30 How does honor your kids feel about this? Having to, having to move? Speaker 6 00:12:36 They don't like it. They know Speaker 7 00:12:39 They don't like it. It's kinda hot. It's kinda hot. You know, the kids had to grow up with other kids and like to have friends, it's not friends knowing someone like a half a year. And then you have to know, uh, the same amount of people another half year. I mean, kids, in other words, kids have to learn how people are. They can't find out if they're not wrong people. And they got to be around different people each time. But why even try, they have to have people and that they keep moving back and forth with, uh, uh, with different kids and not even given a chance to know these kids, like in schools and teachers and so forth, they need this. They really do. They need to, this is, uh, more or less like, um, giving a talk, talking like me and you talking, you have to know each other. And this is the way they can learn from right and wrong. Even with different infants rules. Speaker 1 00:13:35 The problem of housing then for many means constantly being uprooted, crowded, uncomfortable, and angry, angry, because one feels misuse because one perceives real threats to their own welfare, as well as the welfare of their children. Let's move on to another basic item. Food, whether you're a Saint or a sinner, you have to eat, you have no choice. One cannot go about helping himself or anyone else without a stable diet. Listening to the problems of the poor in terms of getting food. Speaker 8 00:14:16 We have heard that there are difficulties with small neighborhood type, uh, groceries. Uh, some people tend to feel that they're paying more money than say, they'd pay a supermarket in another part of the, Speaker 5 00:14:32 She say, yes, that's been going on for years. You couldn't afford. I couldn't afford to buy, uh, uh, the neighborhood groceries around here just about all I can, uh, for, to get is some bread or something like that if I run out. But, uh, I found that I come out much cheaper at the supermarkets, always because they, uh, that price has almost doubled, but they are in the supermarket, knows if it's, because they're not able to bound on a large scale, like the supermarkets, then they have to charge more money. I don't know if they're within the law or not. Right. So what would make them charge so much more than a supermarket is that that could be the difference. It may be. It may be that it costs them more because they can't buy as much. And some are just too overcharging you. Speaker 8 00:15:30 When I fall, I got this child. Don't give a kid pen and cook this for a nickel man. And that's all neck. And he's having these prices. They will sometimes not on him to have a place. Whereas at, uh, you'd pay 21, 20 19 or 21 Sanford camp caught when he was asked, Speaker 3 00:16:03 Really? And if you don't want to be taken and you don't want 'em to really pays for the nose for things, you have to leave your own community to go buy something. And there's added transportation Speaker 5 00:16:16 And transportation classes yesterday is still income at cheap. Speaker 4 00:16:24 Just like I was sitting on a neighborhood store and bought a package of all Alison tabs. She charged me 32 cents for that fake Twitter, 20 something cents a pop. They charged you 88 or something cents a building for eggs, and then go somewhere else and give them a whole lot cheaper. Speaker 3 00:16:44 So if you don't, it'd be really, uh, need something and, and, uh, you don't want to get taken. You have to go out of here community, this shop. That's Speaker 4 00:16:53 Right. Speaker 3 00:16:57 How do most of your neighbors? They hit, man. They ain't, most of your neighbors go out of the communities shouting Speaker 3 00:17:06 You have to go on and shop there anyway. Sometime, Speaker 4 00:17:09 Sometimes you have to go up there and take it, but they charge you eight to set for one dozen eggs, either 2 cents. Okay. Speaker 3 00:17:19 Just off hand. How much would you say they charged for milk and basic and bread? Basic things like the Speaker 4 00:17:25 Nope I'm writing or whatever it is. I don't know, but the milk here, Speaker 3 00:17:31 But at generally, most things are more expensive than Speaker 3 00:17:41 65 or half a gallon. And that's about the whole, it's almost, uh, no, it's about 15 to 18 cents higher per gallon per half down. And you'd pay at a supermarket. Speaker 4 00:17:56 That's right. And, uh, um, bacon. Why did you did shit? Just the shit I'm playing. So Paul, I think his, uh, 38, 38 30 8 cents a pound Speaker 9 00:18:10 69 cents. Speaker 4 00:18:12 Yeah. 69 cents a pound. That's just plain salt pork. And they know, oh, no, uh, breakfast, bacon, just plain salt, pork, Speaker 3 00:18:23 All of your basic foods. And aside from let's just go back now, when we looked at housing, now you're eating your basic foods are even higher. That's true. Speaker 1 00:18:34 The systems then for supplying food to the poor tends to produce humiliation. Although the interviews dealt mainly with small neighborhood groceries because of the usual transportation problems of the poor recent reports seem to indicate that they have to pay more at supermarkets within their neighborhoods as well. So the poor pay more and yet they have less to pay with. Let's take a look at another basic item. Clothing writers from the time of Shakespeare have emphasized the importance of clothing in terms that go beyond mere body warrant. The cloak can dress has significant psychological value when times are hard. It may mean the difference between feeling like someone are just an object who is the butt of some foul joke, listen to their experiences in acquiring clothing. Speaker 3 00:19:32 They have problems around him, keeping clothing for your kids. Speaker 9 00:19:37 That's the problem? Uh, uh, yes, with two, two growing boys. I mean, I, I have a problem keeping clothes on for them. And, uh, I mean, because they, they tear up quite a few, few, uh, closed one where they best to, to a school or, um, which, I mean, I don't, I would too, but, uh, uh, still, I mean, uh, uh, when, when you're not able to buy, buy, buy them, uh, these, these up close every month, I mean, we have no place to turn to, but maybe the volunteers of America, which is every now and then I think they have a clothing drive once a year. Speaker 3 00:20:25 How much would you estimate now? It's 65, 70 $5 a month, uh, for housing. And based on what I can understand, now you have 10 children. How much of a, your budget does that leave you in the spend on other things? Speaker 9 00:20:44 Because when I'm on stem program Speaker 6 00:20:47 And, uh, when I buy the stamps, I play the light and gas. Well, it just really not much. It's just not much. You can sit down and count it up before you get the check and you just like got nothing. Speaker 7 00:21:01 And then again, the kids need clothes for school, uh, other than bedspreads and so forth. I mean, uh, then if you call it and say, you need it, you got to wait something like, uh, six months or maybe even another year before you get Speaker 1 00:21:17 So far, we've taken a look at the basics of shelter, food, and clothing. And the human organism is to survive, grow and develop. It must be involved in certain types of movements and actions, conducive to physical maturation and development. A baby who is handle has a better chance of survival than one who is left in a crib day after day. The same is true of actions and movements, which are organized into some purposeful behavior, as opposed to actions and movements, which are expressed in random fashion recreation then becomes a basic item. Here are some thoughts regarding recreation programs and poor neighborhoods. Speaker 4 00:22:00 They got one recreation place, a founda school ground. I found that they can play up that no, his not supervised. The kids just go in there and it's a couple of Swains and, uh, and that's all and a sliding board. Then I'm took it out now because system got cold and there's no swings up there at all. It's just a wide open field. There. Ain't nothing in there. And most of the time you see, you see Tim 12 wars up on top of the railroad up that hope one and freights running around here, trying to break in at that toy shop and doing that out, trying to break in somebody off there, like the wheels up there on top of that man house, they're trying to get into his dog one house. And we sitting there on the porch and they crawl up the, on top of that Dow shop factory and drop over there across on top of this man's house. Speaker 4 00:22:54 Yeah. To try to get in this house, this house, my neighbor next door. Yeah. They break out the people's car and weapons. They shot mine. I don't shout him. One of them out with BB guns, look at that place all now. I'm broke all of them, glasses in that place, that, all that, and that, that factor, that all that I'm going to give him one of my be be gone, deep polices. Don't try to collect the BB guns and things around here. They shot that one. None of that. They broke this year, the landlord won't put him back and you're looking at the children running around the neighborhood, they'll lose. And they looked like they ain't got nobody to take care of them. They got no chest styles with no guy, nothing to have up. And don't want to go to school and a half I'm skipping school, running around him, dogging around in the neighborhood. Speaker 4 00:23:48 And they get out of here at night and you can go up there up and down that ally. One of them ran and they got Dinesh. Again, one, they got card games on nothing but nothing, but I'll group up 10 and 12 and 13 year old boys. And the girls, they out there acting like that. They 90 years old and they ain't, but about 10 or 12 years old or probably 15, I that stand up in the streets all times a night. Why don't the police? And the people just got these kids just doing this. Well, what would make them come in the house? I 10 to 12 one, o'clock be here on a Friday night. You can't sleep. They walking up and down the street, cussing and Highland and hooping, nothing to hide. And I have seen them group up and get out that the thing had on a piece of pistol shooting at that light. I, that didn't nobody called the police for him at all. Just a group of them. There Speaker 9 00:24:46 Was no, nobody here really Speaker 1 00:24:48 Trying to work with the kids. Then now Speaker 4 00:24:51 It's nobody in this neighborhood to work with them. They used to set up seminars. The county used to send our, uh, what's it Playmobile right in here from the plate. They'll even quit sending that around in the neighborhood. That's really the truth. And I bet you it's over some 800 kids running around here and this young Aaron, Speaker 9 00:25:13 They have no, uh, places to, to play a main would have no recreational area. Uh, as I could say, closed, um, behind, uh, uh, uh, are, should I say in front of me, um, there's a field which everything is thrown into that I feel that could be, be cleaned and, and a recreational area for the children made out of that. But right now it's just simply a dumping ground. That's it? It seems like the, Speaker 1 00:25:54 This then is the reality of being poor by and large current supply system tend to be supportive of the conditions of poverty. The poor stark was less disband and ended up paying more proportionally than citizens and upper income brackets for the same basics that every citizen must have. If he is to have a fighting chance at helping himself to acquire better life. Aside from the question of paying more with less to spend is a factor of the quality of the need items made available to him. This leads to feelings of humiliation and resentment and need areas such as recreation. There is the cold heart fact of a non-existent are grossly low supply, which leads to random drifting expressions of behavior. No matter what accounting techniques want use the poor face, overwhelming odds and their struggles to better themselves. These unmet needs and basic survival areas lead to medical health and social problems, which have not corrected leads to demoralizing forces, complications, and frustrations in areas of social endeavor, such as school or work school and work are supposed to be ways out. Speaker 1 00:27:11 However, the poor come to both with two strikes against them because of unmet needs and basic areas of human growth and development, the odds are against their succeeding. And so the legacy has passed on to another generation with each generation, the despair and anger mounts until one day crime and nihilistic rebellion burst forth and become a horrible reality of the urban terrain. Tonight, you have heard some of the ways in which our supply systems react to the basic needs of the poor, the voices that you've heard, where those of the Negro poor living in an urban ghetto at best we have given you the flavor, the more generalized aspects of the problem. Next week, we will continue our examination of the subculture of poverty. We will look at the vital areas of medical care and the chronically unemployed. We will expand our scope and look at other ethnic groups, especially displaced Southern whites who are among the 28 million poor people in this country today. One final comment and reflection on the subculture of poverty. Speaker 5 00:28:24 Well, I feel like this, we all are human and we all want to have something nice, decent for our children. And we do have shame and we do have pride and I have my pride and they couldn't continue to squished, but I hope one day that my children will have the pride that I have, but be more successful with it. And I haven't been Speaker 0 00:28:43 This program was produced by Dave Lewis for WDET radio Wayne state university, David Paris engineer. This is Wayne State University radio.